Am I a hater of fictional female relationships? Nah, I just prefer the men...

[dangermousie]

I have a confession to make:

girl relationships in a movie/drama/book bore me. I don't mean in a femmeslash sense (which I actually occasionally find very interesting) but relationships between women do not interest me whatsoever.

A relationship between a man and a woman: please yes. Whether it's romantic, family or (as in Capital Scandal between Hero and Secondary Girl) purely friendshippy and platonic? I love. Relationships between men, be they friendships, family, rivalry whatever (but platonic as slash bores me) are also something I get interested in.

But a storyline that focuses on female friendships or family relationships bores me to tears. That is why I do not read a lot of 'women's lit' a la Jennifer Weiner because it's guaranteed to put me to sleep. I need a male character who is at least as prominent as the female in order for the story to really appeal.

And yet, in real life, I am very close to my female relatives and almost all of my friends have been women. Also, I love for my heroines to be strong and cool. How odd.

Another 'shameful' (only I refuse to be shamed :P) pet thing: I do not like stories where women walk all over men, or men are inferior. I don't like the 'am damsel in distress, rescue me' stuff much (the heroine has to have basic competency) but the reversal annoys me just as much. Something like Kimi Wa Petto hits all the wrong buttons for me because of that.

Clearly, am stuck in 19th century.

How about you? Any fiction quirks?

Comments

[shewhohashope.livejournal.com]

I love female friendships/familial relationships!

It's male/male relationships that tend to bore me, unless they're familial, but even then I have a limited patience. I think it may be because so much fiction prizes father/son, brotherhood, male bonding stories. Look all the odd-couple/buddy themed films, 'Luke, I am your father!' moments and general 'bros before hoes' (unless the ho in question is your one true love, in which case, she's NOT a ho) mentality.

This is another reason fiction based on war bores me, it's always all about the men. Because women have no experiences to do with war, obviously.

I'm just ranting all over your journal.

Fictional tropes/themes I enjoy:

- Female heroes/protagonists
-Emotionally distant family members becoming embroiled in strange events and learning to respect and appreciate each other.
- Morally Grey Law Enforcement Representatives
- Powerful older women
- Non-medieval Europe fantasy settings.
- Marriages of convenience becoming something more
- Retellings of folk/fairy tales, legends and mythology
- Me and you against the world dynamics
- Non-evil older women who hold powerful positions
- Thieves/rogues who are (not-so)secretly honourable

And more I'm forgetting.

[filmi-girl.livejournal.com]

Yes. I agree! Especially this - This is another reason fiction based on war bores me, it's always all about the men. Because women have no experiences to do with war, obviously.

What I really hate are female relationships that are only depicted as catty or competitive for male attention. *shudder* The kinds of relationships I find interesting don't get a lot of attention - like Roslin and Starbuck on BSG.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Those are interesting. I actually like war fiction (because of male-centric-stories bias). But not if it's boring technobabble. Yuck.

[melonfusion.livejournal.com]

Oh, marriages of convenience are so much fun! I may just be easy, but I've yet to come across a marriage of convenience plot that failed to bring on the really good, really thick sexual tension.

[shewhohashope.livejournal.com]

Oh! Another thing I like is when a love triangle is resolved with the centre choosing the 'ordinary' man/woman. I always hate the crazy ones/the bastards who need to be healed by someone's love.

This is why I liked Raoul better than Erik. Except in the book, where they're both father-figures (romantic father/mother-daughter/son like relationships freak me out, even if they're not really related), and I just wish she'd forget them both.

[lesbiassparrow.livejournal.com]

I can't watch or read anything that doesn't have a female character in a big role, outside of classical material, that is.

Also, while I don't mind alpha men in visual media and often quite enjoy all the chest-thumping, in books I usually end up wanting to stab them.

[lesbiassparrow.livejournal.com]

Oh! And any poor rich person narrative usually has to work overtime to convince me why I should care about their woes. I don' mean woes like Balie, more woes like the girl in Titanic. I just want to shake them and say 'Look! Can't you see how much worse other people have it!' Honourable exceptions are made fro Irene in The Forsyte Saga and some others.

[fivil.livejournal.com]

I always like the funny guy. Always. Well, maybe not always, just 80% of the time. Even when most of fandom or whatever will just find him irritating. It's just like one of those things; if he's funny, sign me up for the fan club. Ability to amuse me, comic timing can over-ride just about any other characteristic a person or a character has (so I will totally prefer the hilarious, chubby moustached guy over the bland and unamusing but physically attractive guy). You've probably picked up on this based on the stuff I like. XD

(And obviously when I don't like the funny guy, he doesn't make me laugh - hence, not really funny, just trying to be.)

Like, my favourite Aamir role probably should be Fanaa or RDB or Lagaan, and yeah, I love all of those, but my favourite Aamir performance remains Andaz Apna Apna.

The guy in my icon? The funniest character of Heroes (and his cute OTP). And I think this is also why I love Ron Weasley so much.

[plazmah.livejournal.com]

You should watch Avatar. Ignore the fact that it's a Nicktoon; the character Sokka is the very definition of The Funny Guy. ;D

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I confess: i couldn't get all the way through AAA :) Too ott for me :)

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

"Another 'shameful' (only I refuse to be shamed :P) pet thing: I do not like stories where women walk all over men, or men are inferior. I don't like the 'am damsel in distress, rescue me' stuff much (the heroine has to have basic competency) but the reversal annoys me just as much."

Barring the various things of mine that we've talked about a lot or that I've ranted about: That's pretty close to one of mine: The concept that a strong woman must be "like a man" or that a balance of power in a relationship or "good gender dynamics" means that all the power has to be the woman's.

Also the idea that the only way a woman can be strong is if she's a warrior...there are all kinds of strength, and the idea that a woman has to be a warrior to be strong is something I find offensive, because it borders on the "like a man" line.

I find it extremely difficult to get into fiction if there's no half-way decent female character, even in a small role, and I'm a lot harder on male characters than I am on female characters(simply because it's much easier to find good male characters than it is to find good female characters, so I can be picky.)

(Yes, I'm still in the middle of a mental breakdown over fandom bias against female characters, I apologize. I typed up pages and pages ranting about slash last night with allegories to boyfriend stealing and certain forms of schoolyard bullying and about how revolting I find it when women take ANY part of the role of the female in fiction and give it to a male-which is what slashing her love interest is-and call it "progress" and "interesting" and "better.")

Uhm...yes...I will now take my ranting back to keyboard pounding in MS Word and then deleting it.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I want to read the rant! Because I have a feeling I'll agree!

[tkid-firefly.livejournal.com]

Me too on everything except for the slash. Non-explicit, would they just do it already, slash is ftw.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Cool! I am just weird because I havbe no objection to slash but no interest in it either...

[shinystory.livejournal.com]

I'm actually a lot like you, I think.

I don't think that women are shallow at all, but perhaps the marketing--and thus the resulting perception of chick lit is that it's basically only girl power via high heels and make-up. I read them, too, but they don't go up my list of favorites.

My friendships and familial relationships are dominantly female, but in fiction, I like an equal ground. (Maybe it's my Freudian way of conjuring my dream guy...okay, sorry, I'm sounding like something from chick lit now).

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

No, this makes total sense. And I agree.

[thinking-lotus.livejournal.com]

does not liking yaoi/slash much count?

I do have some quirks but I don't remember them until they trip me up ... hmmm ... I don't like a fake fun attitude to serious things (can't stand murder played for laughs), don't like dumb characters (had a hard time with min yeop or whoever in CP), have a weak tolerance for realistic violence ... really really dislike shallow heroes/heroines.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I don't like slash/yaoi either.

I don't mind dumb characters as long as we aren't supposed to believe they are bright.

[thinking-lotus.livejournal.com]

oops, I realized my previous list was more about drama ... hmmm, fiction, I don't have much tolerance for midlist quasi-serious fiction. I tend to go for what Bruce Sterling describes as "slipstream"--

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slipstream_(literature) has all the links I think.

I detest Michael Chabon and writers like him. I like a lot of German novelists. I'm not a big fan of romances in English but I adore shoujo/jousei.

I don't like things to be too "male" (as descirbed by a commenter above). I dont' mind when women are portrayed as being "like men" because I'm often "like a man" but I don't like it when in order to be like men they can't cook or put on makeup or whatever.

how's that?

I had to drop out of 2 book groups because I was "too critical" though ...

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I like Chabon a lot but can see why people won't.

I had to drop out of 2 book groups because I was "too critical" though

Personally, I think this is cool!

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

I don't mind female friendships but only if it's not the focus of the plot. For example I liked the friendship between Lizzy and Jane in Pride & Prejudice a lot. But if it were to be the main story, then perhaps I'd get bored.

Something like Kimi Wa Petto hits all the wrong buttons for me because of that.
Yup. I felt the same way. It's interesting though, that I liked Sapuri a lot. I think it's because Kame's character isn't the type to be stomped upon. He actually tries hard to be recognised by Minami, and though in terms of work he was inferior, he was her equal in other ways.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yeah, in Sapuri Kame wasn't a walkover.

Eeee, gorgeous icon!

[melonfusion.livejournal.com]

I like female relationships, especially sisters and really strong teen/young adult friendships. I've been watching Why Why Love off and on, and I love the relationship between the Jia Di and her friend. She's just so fiercely protective of Jia Di and genuinely wants the best for her. I like the same things in male relationships, too. But with any relationship (female, male, mixed), I either want full on romance, or totally platonic. I hate one-sided yearning, particularly if one party is never honest about his/her feelings and just suffers in silence.

I dislike the incompetent heroine, too! Which leads me to another trope I love, which is the protagonist seeking out the counsel/training of some one older/wiser. Something else I loved about Dog and Wolf was the way Min Ki was so earnestly eager and willing to learn from Roadrunner. I like cocky, but I hate know-it-alls.

For vaguely shameful tropes that I enjoy? Older woman/younger man (despite hating every single character outside of the OTP, What's Up, Fox? is one of my faves, just for that) and rich boy/poor girl. I'm most ashamed about rich boy/poor girl since it's so cliche! And also full of shady class and gender issues, yet for some reason I am a lot more forgiving when this is featured.

[shewhohashope.livejournal.com]

I only like older woman/younger man if I like the characters and the show in general: MNIKSS, Dal Ja's Spring, Sappuri, I'm not sure how kimi wa petto holds up for me now I have more drama experience AND I've read the manga.

[grimorie.livejournal.com]

Oh, man.. my fiction quirks?

My main thing is, for me to fall for a show/book/movie there has to be a female character I can empathize with other wise, I can just like the show but not love it.

Lately, I've also developed a taste for gen stories with strong relationships, somehow just reading romance isn't enough for me anymore. I have to have more to the stories than romantic love to tide me along.

But I've always loved a sort of Beauty and the Beast aspect (Buffy/Angel) to my ship and, more and more I'm falling for the 'no nonsense, practical' woman partnered with 'quirky/dorky' guy (John/Aeryn and to a lesser but still awesome extent, Dani Reese and Charlie Crews).

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

My main thing is, for me to fall for a show/book/movie there has to be a female character I can empathize with other wise, I can just like the show but not love it.

So very true.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I am generally quite un-interested with females in fiction, they are usually like an addition to the guys I like. It is rarely that I get to like a female character too much and almost always this happens when I can identify with this character myself. So female relationships are fine, but just as an addition too.

I LOVE guy's relationships, though, but not in gay sense which doesn't interest me. But I LOVE good friendship stories, father/son, teacher/pupil stories; they sometimes work better for me than romance when they are well-done.

With the guys, I like non-alfa guys when they are NOT weak, for example I love love love Mishkyn in "Idiot". It doesn't have to be alfa, but I can't fall in love with weakness. But generally, yes - alfa is good.

Something like "Kimi Wa Petto" makes me run away in horror as it feels morally wrong for me (not because weak guy/strong girl but because taking people like some kind of a pet = wrong for me). I have this thing - I can't stomach something when it feels morally wrong for me. HEEE! I AM OLD-FASHIONED!

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

So female relationships are fine, but just as an addition too

Exactly.

taking people like some kind of a pet = wrong for me

Couldn't get over it myself. Just too weird.

[kitkat-cat.livejournal.com]

I am not too bothered with female/female relationships, get more than enough of that in real-life without having to read about it. Also, being surrounded by more than 2 women at one time, is a bit of a nightmare for me, so I am only very close to a small group of women, rather than knowing a lot of them...

I do really love male/male relationships, but not in a slashy kind of way, but in a more brotherhood and honour way.

Like you, I really hate stories where men are inferior...I can deal with a weak woman (within reason), but i really like the ones where the both of them are equal. Strangely enough, I also have something against men who have too much of a sense of humour...i dont know why, i guess i like my heroes tortured, that, or I have just read far too many romance novels for my own good!

I am not keen on anything set in the future, or anything that involves time travel as i always get too obsessed with the logic and sequence of events. I love older women in the story, be they good or bad, initially unhappy relationships/marriages (due to baron pointing large sword at you, or for convenience sake, ala Full House) but later gets worked out, and finally things that have vampires, werewolves etc. in them, except for the fark hunter series, that one, I love! :)

I liked Kimi Wa Petto, only for the WTF factor!

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

get more than enough of that in real-life without having to read about it.

Exactly.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

So, you fast-forwarded through lots of Farscape then, huh?

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Nope.

????

Unless you mean when Zhaan, Aeryn, Chiana et al interacted with each other? Nope. But that's the thing, for once it was about their personalities and other various interesting issues, not 'OMG, it's all about my mom/my boyfriend/my shoes.' Aeryn et al were interesting characters, not defined by their 'femaleness' as so many women on TV or in books are. Perhaps I should have clarified that I meant female/female relationships as portrayed in most chick lit/shows.

[lenabean.livejournal.com]

Hmm...I just realized I might be a bit weird by not finding fictional h/c too appealing. I mean, I don't dislike it; it's just that I'm not really inclined towards it and actually too much of it will bore me.

Now that I think about it, this probably explains why I was never too interested enough in TBDW to start it, despite it starring my favorite kdrama actor, LJK. Hmmm, this is probably why Iljimae is not currently appealing to me either. All the spoilers I've read for it talk about the h/c and LJK's character getting beaten up all over the place.

I like the romance, the angst, and the manpain, but all on the emotional level. Seeing a character get physically pulverized just does nothing for me. I find the very weird about myself considering that so many females like the h/c aspect of dramas and other fictional stuff.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Not liking h/c is probably healthy :) Also, when I talk about h/c in a drama, bear in mind that it is something I like so I will probably emphasize it...todaw is a lot of psychological misery not constant beat-downs :)