Anakin's redemption

[dangermousie]

This is probably my last post before Monday, 30th, as I am going to Spain.

I was thinking of the fact that Palpatine doesn't realize there isn't much tying Anakin to the Sith, and that is his downfall. Anakin turns and grovels (I cannot bear to watch that scene) because he thinks after he's killed Mace that he is irredeemably damned anyway now (I can't see old-school Jedi being much on redemption and forgiveness), and he might as well try to do the best he can and save Padme. But with Padme dead, that carrot that Palpatine had is gone (I think he'd dispose of her eventually anyway, if she survived, because he didn't want Anakin to have a "good angel"). And Anakin never is much into power or torture for the enjoyment of it. Thus, the only reason, really, that he sticks to Palpatine is because he has nothing else, and because he thinks he is unworthy of forgiveness and can never go back.

But then, enter Luke. Now he has someone to live for. And more importantly, Luke believes that he can be redeemed and thus the last hold over him that Palpatine has (you are damned so cannot change it) is gone.

I hope Palpatine agonized for a bit as he was falling down that reactor shaft that he was killed by his own apprentice, but not for a usual Sith reason, but because Anakin returned to good and wanted to protect his son. I also wonder if the bit with Palpatine torturing Luke brought back to Vader the moment in the Mace-Palpatine duel that also involved energy strikes and his very different reaction.

Comments

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

It really all comes full circle at that moment again doesn't it. The first time he tried to protect his child from the Emperor he did the wrong thing, but he's given a second chance and he takes it. It the double edged weapon of love that the Emperor doesn't understand that saves Anakin. He loves his son. That's the bottom line. He tried to move heaven and hell for his child and failed and he's finally given another shot. It's love that ultimately saves everyone. Obi Wan's love for Anakin makes him willing to die for Luke's sake, Anakin's love for Luke breaks a twenty year hold over him, Luke's love for his father redeems him.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Oh yes. Everything comes full circle. What the Emperor forgets (because he is a sociopath) is that if Anakin was willing to sell his soul to save someone he loved, he would be willing even to go against his Sithness to protect a loved one. Not even 20+ years of being Palpy´s slave and wallowing in the Dark Side have eradicated the capacity for love in Anakin. Yes, he was capable of redemption indeed.

[rabidfangurl.livejournal.com]

Thus, the only reason, really, that he sticks to Palpatine is because he has nothing else, and because he thinks he is unworthy of forgiveness and can never go back.

YES YES YES! Exactly my thoughts on the matter. He doesn't stay with Palpy out of loyalty or gratitude or desire to for power (because Anakin never wants power alone, he only wants it if he can have a co-ruler [see Padme and Luke]), but because in the end, all he has left is the Dark. Not only would the old Order be really, really unforgiving, but also, there is literally no one left to forgive him. Plus, Padme is gone, his body is gone, his kids are gone, and so all he has is Palpy.

I swear, between RotS and post-ANH, Despair/Vader = OTP.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yes. I love your Vader-despiar story btw.

Parodoxically it is his belief that he is unworthy of forgiveness that leads him further and further the dark path until Luke.

[rabidfangurl.livejournal.com]

Parodoxically it is his belief that he is unworthy of forgiveness that leads him further and further the dark path until Luke.

::character insight turns on::

Some of that, I think, flows from the fact that the last person he ever sees and talks to before he is sealed into the suit is Obi-Wan, who sets conditions on his love for Anakin. And, thinking about it further, Padme vaguely does the same thing in their last conversation, though I doubt she means to.

They basically tell him: "If you are good, we will love you. But you *aren't* good, and so we *don't* love you." Working off of this template, Anakin sees no way back to the light, because he'll never be good enough (which is one of his major insecurities *anyway*). Then, suddenly, there is Luke, who goes through a lot of stuff at Vader's hands and yet keeps saying that he loves Anakin, no matter what. Pure, unconditional love, which is something that Anakin thought he lost with his mother. And so when the final choice comes, Anakin acts. Because no matter what, Luke loves him, and so Anakin can ignore what he's done and grab for that hope.

[wasabi-girl1.livejournal.com]

YOU ARE MAKING ME WANT TO WATCH ROTJ! Actually, I think I will after this! :D

Also: Vader did want to rule the galaxy with Luke, the same offer he made to Padme. I don't think he ever had a huge allegiance to Palpatine.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yes. Once he realized Palpatine´s true nature, any love evaporated. When he pledges himself, it is not out of affection. It is out of despair and desire to do ANYTHING to save Padme.

[wasabi-girl1.livejournal.com]

Watched RotJ again, and now you can actually understand what Vader is thinking. You can almost HEAR him thinking about Padme right before he kills the Emperor!

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Oh, I simply must rewatch ROTJ now. Luke´s words are so much more poignant now that they are a shadow of Padme´s in ROTS

[wasabi-girl1.livejournal.com]

I watched ANH again too, and everything seems to have a double meaning now, if you take it in new contexts, which is awesome! :)

[lazypadawan.livejournal.com]

Great observation re Mace and Palpatine. Wow!

You are right about Vader sticking with Palpie because there is nothing else for him and nowhere else he can go.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

In a way, by being so inflexible, and by trying to make Anakin to live up to an impossible (and rather pointless) ideal, the Jedi dug their own grave. If he knew that there was a chance he could be saved, he would not have turned. But I get the feeling that he feels that once he kills Mace, he simply cannot BE good, no matter his inclinations, and almost that he feels he has no chocie in the matter.

[lazypadawan.livejournal.com]

I got the impression from viewing #2 that Anakin believed as well that first saving Padmé/his unborn child and second saving the Republic would in the end be worth what he does. When those are all lost to him...he's up the creek and he knows it. So why try being good?

It's too late for me, my son.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Oh yes. He really did want peace, justice, and happiness of his family. All wonderful goals, but completely twisted by Palpatine...

[dawntreader717.livejournal.com]

I also wonder if the bit with Palpatine torturing Luke brought back to Vader the moment in the Mace-Palpatine duel that also involved energy strikes and his very different reaction.

Very good observation. It will make me watch Ep. 4-6 very differently now.

BTW, did you hear Lucas wants to make all 6 movies 3-D and re-release them? :-)