Cassandra Claire - making good?

[dangermousie]

The other day in the bookstore, right outside the cafe where I was bound with my haul of books, I noticed a copy of Cassandra Claire's City of Bones and, driven by morbid curiousity, picked it up.

For those of you not familiar with Harry Potter fandom (lucky you!), once upon a time, CC was the BNF to end all BNFs - she was the biggest fanfic author in the fandom, by far. Her status rested on the Draco Trilogy - a trio of ginormously long and hideously popular fanfics with Draco Malfoy as the main character (as she is responsible for Draco as sexy leather-pants-wearing-stud, I may never forgive her). In terms of my personal preferences in Harry Potter, DT was basically the polar opposite - cult of Draco, Harry/Hermione, etc. Yet, despite it, I confess that I was addicted to DT almost a decade ago (yes, it was a long time). I eventually lost interest in it when the third and final part of her trilogy kept getting longer and longer and the time between updates got longer and longer as well, and I never finished it. (I must say, I remain impressed with the fact that CC eventually completed it - a lot of BNF fanfics go on forever and never get done).

This is the good part. Now the not so good. I was not in the Potter fandom as it had too many crazies for my liking, but I do know that CC had as many huge scandals as she had popularity (ahhhh, the BNF drama!) There was plagiarism - apparently she routinely lifted chunks of dialogue from Buffy, Red Dwarf etc without crediting (I don't really care about that but a lot of people were upset. It was that kerfuffle that introduced me to Buffy so I will always be grateful.) There was getting expensive gifts from fangirls under false pretenses. There was the general "I am queen of the world, worship me" attitude at cons.

As a result of all of this, and the fact that CC wanted to get published, she took her fic off the web (you can still find it though) and disappeared from the fandom.

And then she published her own YA fantasy fiction trilogy, of which City of Bones is the first part.

I tried CoB a long time ago and gave up a few pages in - it just felt like an overwrought hard slog (going back to DT, I remember plenty of overwroughtness there too. I think I used to like it more when I was younger though). A sort of too-many-crystallized-adjectives thing. I know CC exhibited good taste and liked Dunnett (my second-favorite writer of all time) but Dunnett is one of the very few authors who CAN pull off that ornate style - in CC's hands it just comes across as a bit incoherent.

But being a tenacious sort, I decided to give CoB another chance, shamefully swayed by the fact that in the meantime I found out that at one point the heroine and her OTP believe they are brother and sister with much angsting. Kdramas, what have you done to me!

So I tried again. The beginning is still a ridiculously hard slog - it does not flow at all. But then, about 50 pages in, it picks up and it's been great good fun since then - I don't really want to put it down, in fact.

Which is YAY! I have never cared about personalities of writers - have you heard some of the things Gogol used to espouse? Or a whole plethora of Soviet authors I used to love?

All I care is that I found a book I enjoy reading.

CC can be a plagiarizing, manipulative ***** for all I care - as long as her books entertain me.

Comments

[bennet-7.livejournal.com]

shamefully swayed by the fact that in the meantime I found out that at one point the heroine and her OTP believe they are brother and sister with much angsting.

That's what got me interested. I'd heard people compare it to Twilight and that put me off but having such low expectations, I was pleasantly surprised. Unlike Twilight it has an actual plot and an interesting mythology (not overly original but still, it's better than *sparkling*). I did get quite sick of CC's pretentious references (describing scenes by comparing them to paintings) and characters' physical perfection but the latter is practically a given in urban fantasy these days.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I have no expectations at all - I usually don't, either for YA or fantasy, so this was a pleasant surprise.

[village.livejournal.com]

Plagiarism is one of the things I absolutely loathe the most so I can never fully enjoy a writer once I know they've partaken in it. As far as I know, a lot of people enjoy CoB so definite kudos to her for that but while I believe an entertaining book is an entertaining book, I will never buy anything she writes.

Also, I heard that someone bought the rights to her trilogy. So it may be coming to a theatre near you.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

It would make a ridiculously entertaining bad movie :)

[main-hoon-emily.livejournal.com]

I started reading City of Bones a while ago and then put it down when I realized it wasn't the book I thought it was -- I had it confused with that Melissa Marr series about fairies so I kept thinking, "What is all this nonsense about Nephilim? Where are the fairies?" I might give it another chance one of these days when the reserve list at the library gets down to a manageable length.

I'd heard about her plagiarism in HP fanfiction but could never figure out what it was all about. I guess as long as she's not doing it in her published work who really cares?

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I shall randomly drop in to say that, if you haven't read them yet, the Marr books (or at least the first 2) are quite good, though dark and sometimes uncomfortable, and it takes a while for most of the characters to get interesting in the first.

[walkwithheroes.livejournal.com]

Speaking of her having plagiarism in her novels - quite recently someone did a "study" of her Draco fics and her first published novel - she lifted from her Draco fics for her novel. It seems she took descriptions and lines.There's nothing wrong with that, but it makes me lol to think that she "stole" material from herself.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Ahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[main-hoon-emily.livejournal.com]

That is funny. Did she think no one would notice or is she hoping her fan-fiction fans will pick out the similarities? I heard that was a big draw for her fanfic, that there were contests or something to see who could identify the most quotes from other sources.

[walkwithheroes.livejournal.com]

You know, it is so word-for-word, that she has to know she "stole" from herself. It may be that the lines and what-not are more 'Easter Eggs' for the DT fans. Or she was just lazy and did a little copy-paste, because she could.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I bet it's the latter. It doesn't bother me (though if I were insane enough to doubt Jace = Draco before that, I would not after) but it was a bit jarring :)

[walkwithheroes.livejournal.com]

Oh, Jace is so Draco.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

It is nice to know CC is so faithful to her fictional type.

Though I find Jace a lot less irritating - he has less pages to get all doomed-aristocrat-with-issues on me.

[walkwithheroes.livejournal.com]

I started the first book once and never finished. I think I got twenty pages in, if that. But, I've read all about this books. And - isn't he less emo because he's always making out with Clary or whatever the girl is called.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I think he is less emo because her trilogy is shorter than DT :) Plus, yes, hot make-outs are good for stress relief, even if less so if you think the girl is your sibling.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

LOLOL - I have had that experience, reading the wrong book.

I guess as long as she's not doing it in her published work who really cares?



Yup.

[tlace.livejournal.com]

Just last night I was picking up Blood Promise (from the Vampire Academy series) at B&N and discovered City of Bones which COMPLETELY intrigued me, mostly from the description on the back cover. I was already spending money on a book I KNEW I wanted so I left it there but added CoB to my mental list for later. So your post hints of fate :)

It is very interesting to hear the story of the author AND to hear that you are enjoying the book. I'll definitely have to read CoB now :)

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yeah - it's not a great book, but it's entertaining.

[ancarett]

Sadly, her books don't entertain me. I still find her characters very derivative. It's almost as if I squint and see Spike, you know? I read through the first three chapters of a friend's copy and remained rather cynical so I decided I'm not buying it.

Plagiarism is one of those authorial crimes that really bugs me so I'm not at all inclined to give her any more of my time. I'll read the work of someone whose politics is quite different from mine without a thought, but a plagiarist really rankles me as an academic and researcher/writer, myself.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I don't see Spike but I do see her fanon Draco in Jace from CoB. Ehhhh, it entertains me so all is forgiven :)

[plazmah.livejournal.com]

I too was all about the Draco Trilogy at a young age, despite the fact that the fic irked me in many ways. I haven't got around to reading CoB but I have read ladyjaida's Havemercy and I kinda want to read Tithe by blackholly too.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I just read Tithe last weekend. it was good, though I think Melissa Marr did the same thing better. (Though Marr did it several years later, so Tithe's success may have given her more freedom in certain areas.)

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Spoil me about the ships in Marr books - I looked them up and they sound interesting but I need to know the ending.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

In the first book, she chooses her best friend over the fairy king, but apparently the third book (which I haven't read yet) has more complications along that vein, but I'm hoping that it will have him finally turn to the bride who failed to break the curse centuries earlier. (I may be prejudiced, as she's my favorite character, but it seemed to imply that he did love her, they just couldn't be together because of the rules of fairy.) The heroine in the second doesn't actually end up with anyone, but she actually really needed to not be with anyone right then. She actually spends a chunk of the book with the creepy rapey guy, but dumps him, and is a lot closer to being ready for a relationship by the end, and i wouldn't be surprised if she later ends up with the other (better, though I'm not quite sure I'll be comfortable with it) guy.

As a warning, a strong theme through the books is a deconstruction of fae myth through the perspective of rape themes (faery wine and enchantments luring mortal lovers, etc.) and it's handled a bit awkwardly in the first. (I know you don't get as twitchy at rape themes as I do, but it really is strong at times, especially in the second book.)

I haven't posted in the Black yet, but I have on those two.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Thanks!

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

ooooh, I will look those up, thanks for the heads up!

[thelana.livejournal.com]

I flove your pragmatism and I agree :)

It helps that I generally think that most actors, singer, writers and artist in generally are probably basket cases in real life and that even the nicest possiblity doesn't help me squat if you are for example a crappy actor.

I confess I sometimes wonder how I would deal if an actor I really loved or who was in a movie I really loved ended up something really criminal, would I still be able to watch it undiluted (basically "what if Harrison Ford turned out to be a pedophile"). Generally I think I would try to ignore it because (1) I at least want to believe in the idea of the art standing apart from the person, basically, I should be able to enjoy something even if I know nothing about the person behind the art, whether or not they save orphans or kick puppies (2) with movies for example I always figure that they weren't the only ones involved, other actors, extras, directors, producers, random set people, would it really be fair to slight their work too just because one of the people involved turned out to be a bad guy?

/rambling

[thelana.livejournal.com]

On the subject of plagiarism, I kinda think that if it happens it should primarily whether/how much money the author gets, not what my enjoyment of something should be.

Of course my little experience with plagiarized stuff has been of people who obviously couldn't do any writing by themselves (like the parts between original and stolen writing were really transparent, or it was obvious that the text was written with a different fandom in mind). I think in those cases the books of these people would be crap anyway, even with stolen parts.

But if their writing is capable enough, should I truly flaggelate myself for liking it? It seems that the obvious result should be that they pay huge fines, be forced to give co-credit, give back awards or allow the original author the right to pull the book entire. But should I really feel like I should burn my personal copy?

I guess it helps that I generally don't believe in worshipping authors, so for me there is no facor in losing respect for an author and thinking less of them because they plagiarized, because I generally don't have much of a personal opinion on authors anyway.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Re: plagiarism. Exactly. Copyright laws deal with that sort of thing - if some author has issues with plagiarism and can prove it, they can take it up in court. For me, I am going to read and enjoy a published book, the end.

[thelana.livejournal.com]

Yes, I understand when it's a bit different in the fanfiction world because there are no laws to protect it, but in the real world? I leave it to the courts to punish it and assume they don't need my righteous anger to help them out, I'll just wait for the result and not care how the money I pay for it is being split.

I guess it doesn't help that one of my childhood authors was a more pulp style writer from the 1800s where it was more or less known that he must have stolen the majority of his location descriptions from various other travel books. But they're still childhood loves to me even with all their flaws and embarrassements.

I think that's why I had a hard time relating for example when there was this scandal recently about that romance author who took her infodumps from various nature magazines. I read one of her books once and it always seemed obvious to me that she probably didn't write those infodumps herself. (her style was still awful, infodumps or not)

Again, not saying she shouldn't cough up the money, just the opposite, but I didn't get the moral outrage. I mean, isn't it to assume that most authors would get their factual bits from somewhere? I mean, I know some romance authors are history students/teachers/researchers themselves, but I assume not all are. And while it is is undoubtedly lazy not to rephrase what your find, I also assume there is a limited amount of ways you can go about rephrasing a sentence about what ancient piece of wardrobe looks like or what the mating habits of bird X are.

Basically, I assume most authors are stealing those infos from somewhere, whether they rephrase or not. Or maybe I just have read too many cheap bodice ripper romance novels with embarrassingly obvious infodumps by a variety of authors.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yeah - I basically don't care about rl of any author/actor/singer/whoever. They could be killing puppies and if I like their product, whatever.

Polanski is, IMO, a great director even if he is a pedophile. It means I won't invite him to a party and he should go to jail but if he makes a movie I can certainly appreciate it.

[tatterpunk.livejournal.com]

I had more or less the same response recently to the entire trilogy, which I've been meaning to blog about. She's terribly amateurish on a sheer prose, words-and-bits level, but has so much sheer fun telling her story I get sucked in. Sibling love! Evil dads! Sexy vampires! Flying motorcycles! I mean, I can't withstand that kind of awesomely cheesy barrage.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Isn't it like a shoujo manga come to life or what?

[lydzi.livejournal.com]

I always really hated that trilogy. Never understood the appeal of it :/.
Then again, it's odd because, despite my feelings toward that fanfic, I'm still glad that CC is being published. Probably because she's one of the HP fandom and I've been in it so many years that it feels somehow close (there were crazy years ^^).

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

HP fandom was so ridiculously entertainingly insane.

[mishane.livejournal.com]

Oh that's so interesting, to have a writer in fandom who turned out to be a real life author. I always wondered if any of the Buffy writers were writers IRL, they were so good at their fic. I know some of them are published writers but when I googled I found out that most of their books were slash and . . . something I wasn't into.

Hmm, if I see that book in the bookstore I might pick it up. Even though I never read or was part of the Harry Potter fandom.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yeah - it's always interesting to see a fandom author 'make good.'

[sodahands.livejournal.com]

This trilogy is a big guilty pleasure of mine. I know that she's ripped off almost every fandom from Buffy to Star Wars but the books are really entertaining. The second and third books are annnoyingly long with a lot of unnecessary purple prose thrown in.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yup - just like her fanfic :)

[syrenstar.livejournal.com]

It wasn't just dialogue from TV, which badly distracted me from the DD plot as is, in the last part of the trilogy she was copying practically word for word paragraphs from a published fantasy series.

She was working as a journalist at the time and doesn't have the luxury of being an ignorant 14 year old fangirl, plagiarism is serious business.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I think it's a free-for-all in fanfic - the whole thing is derivative to start with. I guess it's just a topic I honestly don't care about. If any author has an issue they can invoke copyright laws and sue and I am fine with that, but on a personal reading level it bothers me not at all.

[walkwithheroes.livejournal.com]

Ah, I remember that. I have a lot of issues with her 'tude. I think when she started lifting whole stuff - did she deny it? I seem to recall she said she "forgot" she had read it in another book. Oh well, it wasn't published. And, if she lifted stuff into her novel - well, that's for the lawyers.


I'll be honest - I read the last couple of chapters of the Draco stories and really hated her writing style. She had some good ideas, and good for her for getting published. She went for the right market - urban teen fantasy is big right now. Yes, she used stereotypes and cardboard cut-out characters with personalities I've seen before. And yes, her prose is still weak and there are many grammar and structure mistakes (its called proofreading, publishers). All this aside - the woman went for it, so good for her. I'll never buy it, but if people are entertained, so be it.

[hope-fuleigh.livejournal.com]

I started her series immediately after reading all four (oh yes, ALL FOUR) of the Twilight novels while on vacation, so the sheer relief that came with the presence of a plot was almost euphoric. It had some witty dialogue, and if you gloss over some of the clumsier writing, it's not half-bad.

At the end of the day, the strength of the main and secondary ships are what really draw me into this type of novel, and she had some pretty good material in that regard.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yeah - it's angsty, trashily fun, and has a plot. That is all I need.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Out of curiosity, who's your favorite author of all time? (I have the first Lymond and one other Dunnett, but haven't read them yet. Primarily because, from what I've heard, I may end up hating Lymond himself for a good chunk ofthe time.)

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

My favorite author of all time is Erich Maria Remarque (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remarque).

Dorothy Dunnett is my second favorite. Lymond is my favorite male fictional character. Re: hating Lymond. I hated him for most of book 1 - tried to figure out what the hell was going on with him. I ended up feeling a great deal of pity for him by the end of book 1 and loving him when everything was explained. He can be horribly cruel but not only has he been messed up and abused by others beyond the telling of it, he is worse on himself than on anybody else (he believes he is not worthy of anyone's love or care ridiculously deeply) and he is ridiculously self-sacrificing precisely because he believes in his own lack of worth. He basically dreams of suicide for 2+ books in a row and is only stopped from it because his word was extracted from him not to go for it in exchange for something spoilery. He also has major sex issues - he is a rape victim himself (which isn't helped by the fact that he later trades himself for sex voluntarily, too - to get information or to save his companions from having to do it) so he has a major inverse of virgin/whore complex - as in he isn't good for anyone who isn't unspoiled and screwed up. Anywho, he is a total mess who knows it and tries to stay away from anyone while being brilliant. He is not a nice person but he is a good one, if it makes sense. Plus, he is one half of my biggest OTP of all time.

Side note, since I know this is an issue for you, if you want to read a spoilery, very spoilery outline of all the sexual issues (Lymond's and other characters) that you might have to deal with, here it is (http://dangermousie.livejournal.com/833376.html). It's crazy spoilery though.

PG Wodehouse is number 3.

Jorge Amado is number 4. You might like him - his novels almost always feature women of color as protagonists and they are usually amazing, amazing women. if I had to pick my favorite female character of all time Tereza Batista of his 'Tereza Batista, home from the wars' would be it. She is a 'mixed-blood' rural Brazillian sold by her aunt and uncle to a child abuser for sex (fair warning - some scenes in that book are horrific) who ends up killing him and escaping. A lot of things happen, and she ends up organizing a prostitutes' union, becoming a muse, leading a mission of mercy in an illness-stricken town, and even finding love with a man who is good (but that love is not portrayed as anything needed to complete her. Anyway, that is a tangent. If you want something less wrenching, Gabriela Cloves and Cinammon and Dona Flor and Her Two Husbands are wonderful. Don't read War of the Saints though as one subplot will trigger all of your pet hates at once.

Charles Dickens is number 5.

[acakeofcheese.livejournal.com]

I am going to sound ridiculously ignorant, but what is a BNF?

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

BNF = Big Name Fan (i.e.a bigwig in fandom)