Who is this pod person and what has she done with Maria?

[dangermousie]

OK, I have just finished season 3 of Roswell. Yes, it was 15 episodes, yes I pulled an all nighter, yes, I am insane.

I have a bazillion comments I want to make, but I really must get a rant out first.

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! There, now I feel a bit better.

What on earth happened to Maria? Has she been replaced by a pod person mid season without anyone noting? She went from my favorite female character on the show (yes, even more so than Liz) to someone I wanted to aim a 2x4 at. From someone who was flaky but had good heart and plenty of common sense, she turned into a completely selfish, self-absorbed twit. I am not even going to go into how she pulled away from Liz who really needed her. What really got me was the utterly thorough mind job she did on Michael.



Every time Liz pulled back from Max she had a really really good reason: in S2 it was destiny and Future Max, in S3, the brief bit she had was because she was turning into an alien and to be with Max physically caused her pain. These are pretty freaking legitimate. And every time, she really got “punished” for it, because actions have consequences (Max got together with Tess, she was in severe pain in S3 etc). But Maria?

OK, I can fanwank that she had that moment of “is that really it, is this how my life is going” that most girls have pretty early in the relationship much later than most because earlier there was one constant threat after another and Michael was most likely not going to be around anyway. It takes some hard fanwanking because it would help if we ever saw her earlier dissatisfied with Roswell and Michael and we haven’t. But I can do it.

I can even fanwank kissing an ex while in a relationship (sorry, BIG no) as an impulse she couldn’t control thing.

So I can deal with her breaking up with Michael, even though it makes not too much sense, and my heart breaks for him when he is being so sweet and desperate and gentle and at the end the flowers in his hands crumble into dust (OK, so I cried. That whole ep makes me depressed as what Michael fears will happen does. And he can't control his powers. I guess his life is literally falling apart).

What I can’t deal with very well are the head games she plays with Michael afterwards, and how she is so about “Maria needs” that she does not consider for a second what she is doing to him.

He gave up going home for her. And he is the sweetest, nicest bf any girl can ask for. Really. The least she could do is not to fuck him up because she doesn’t want to think of anyone other than Maria.

OK, Michael is a guy. He is a guy who is terrible at reading people. But even a really “attuned” guy would be screwed up by her approach. The whole episode where they look for a New Year’s party and he gets sick and she is just upset about how he is ruining her life and her fun and he overhears her and tells her to go and he is fine (even though he is clearly not) and she does? OK, 2x4 coming out. She is really really hurting him in that scene, and anyone with one eye can see it, but she chooses to just ignore it. Argh.

And don’t even get me started on the whole “it’s all about me” approach. Maria wants sex? OK. Maria wants a friend? OK. But what does she think she is doing, going back to have a night of sex with a guy who still loves her and wants her back? That is really selfish and irresponsible and what drives me up the wall is when she is talking to Liz the morning after and says that “oh yeah, we are friends with benefits, Michael won’t think we are back together, he knows the score.” Earth to Ms. Egotist here? You just spent the night with the man who is trying to win you back. What do you think he is going to think? The fact that it doesn’t occur to her for a second about what she is doing to Michael just boggles the mind. The thing that I loved about Maria is that she really cared about other people and thought about them. I guess not any more. She doesn’t even think about the consequences of her actions and that they hurt people. Argh!

Also, hello? Michael already has issues about trusting people and opening up to people. Maria knows that, better than anyone, really. To keep doing this bait and switch on him is just plain cruel. No wonder Michael tries and tries and then finally gives up and starts reverting into “I don’t need anyone, my way or the highway” S1 Michael. That is why he gets so obsessed about the alien thing again. Because once again, his life completely sucks.

And Maria (unlike Liz) gets no fallout. I am very happy she decided to come along, and give up all she’s known to be with him at the end. But really, by the end, I was so annoyed with her, I was mainly happy for Michael’s sake. And what if she flakes again? Hopefully, she has already had her existential crisis and is past that. And Michael loves her. But I am still annoyed.

Well, at least I am thoroughly happy with Max and Liz.

ETA: I rewatched a bunch of eps and I feel much better about Michael and Maria. I think she just freaked because she realized that she was set for the rest of her life in this course and overreacted (it's kinda connected to being worried about not being able to live without him, so she wants to prove she can). And because she does feel bad and yet still is freaking she tries to ignore that she is hurting Michael because than she would feel really bad and not be able to go through with it. Basically, she is having a long major freak-out. When she realizes that she can lose him forever and have a life without him, it hits her, what she really wants and she snaps out of it. And considering she decides to give up everything in her life and come along and be with him, I think her fit is over and she's proven how she feels. Neither Michael nor she are much for verbal apologies after all, but apologize through their actions. I feel better.

Comments

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

Yeah, about the middle of season 3 I think the series sort of lost it, mainly because I wanted the Michael/Maria relationship to at least work out normal, but like I said in a post a while back, when Maria starts playing head games, Michael can't deal with it. Frankly, he's not wired to deal with it. The poor guy is horrible at reading people, which isn't really his fault since he's extremely up front with them and should expect them to be the same with him. I like Maria up to that point because she IS really patient with him and gets a guy who's really worthwhile and devoted to her in return, but then she just does a complete character reversal and basically slaps him in the face, rips his heart out, stomps on it and hands it back. Michael can be a jerk sometimes, but he doesn't deserve that at all. He's an inadvertant jerk, he's not trying to hurt anyone or be selfish (he's probably the least selfish of the group) and what always gets me about him is that he's trying so hard. My personality is very much the same way, and when someone hurts him like that, he completely shuts down again. It's like Maria proved his fear of putting himself out there. And she didn't care. And she doesn't see how bad he's hurting, which is pretty obvious since Michael can't hide his emotions at all. She doesn't see how much he needs her, she just cuts him loose and makes him think it's his fault. It's so pathetic when he's asking her if she'll come back for him and she says she doesn't know. If roles were reversed, Michael would be there for her until the bitter end, willing to die for her.

The thing that I disliked the most is that I LIKE Maria up until that point. I figure part of the abruptness of their relationship is that the series got cancelled, but still.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

The thing is, I loved the way they were going with Max and Liz the whole way through, but the Michael/Maria thing just made NO sense.

The poor guy is horrible at reading people, which isn't really his fault since he's extremely up front with them and should expect them to be the same with him.

And the thing is, Maria knows that. She knows him inside out, literally. And, honestly, even if she didn't, in the interest of fairness, you shouldn't treat anyone you even remotely tolerate the way she treats Michael. Upfront? Yes. Maria didn't seem to even think for a second how she would like to be treated the way she is treating him. If you have stuff to deal with, I guess you can't help it. But to not even consider the feelings of the other person, and to know you are really messing with them and keep on doing it? Ugh. Any person who does that is just not a good human being.

then she just does a complete character reversal and basically slaps him in the face, rips his heart out, stomps on it and hands it back

And the thing that drives me absolutely nuts is that she is not even thinking she is doing anything wrong. The second time she shows up at his apartment at night and wants to talk, she is surprised that he isn't delighted to see her, considering she came by the night before, basically messed with his head yet again, and treated it like it was all in a day's work.

If she wanted a break, fine. But then stay away from him. You can't have your cake and eat it too, not if doing so is really killing the other person.

I must admit I was cheering for the Evil!Michael when he kicked her out of the car and told her what he thought of her behavior, for once. And Maria wanted him to apologize? O-kaaaaaay.

It's like Maria proved his fear of putting himself out there. And she didn't care. And she doesn't see how bad he's hurting, which is pretty obvious since Michael can't hide his emotions at all. She doesn't see how much he needs her, she just cuts him loose and makes him think it's his fault

Exactly. Basically, his worst fear came true. He let her inside and showed her things in his head and made himself utterly vulnerable to her. And she basically kicked him in return.

She rejected him and said it was his fault for stifling her. Whatever.

He already has issues with being unworthy or a "monster" because of his powers. He doesn't need any more.

It doesn't take someone who was able to "really see" Michael to be able to know you shouldn't be doing it. Anyone with any empathy could see it.

he's asking her if she'll come back for him and she says she doesn't know. If roles were reversed, Michael would be there for her until the bitter end, willing to die for her

Exactly. That was just really cold of her. And unfair. Ok, simple proposition. If you love someone, you want them to be happy and you want to be with them. You go off and find yourself (whatever that means) but you want to come back to them.

The thing that I disliked the most is that I LIKE Maria up until that point.

I know. I went from really shipping M/M and loving both of them, to not even liking Michael and Maria together any more, because I didn't think she was good enough for him (or anyone who really loved her for that matter). Not without some soul searching on her part, first.

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

I feel bad for Michael too simply because he just needs someone who will be there for him and he never really finds it. I don't see how he could conceivably not always have in the back of his mind that Maria might just walk out on him again and not come back. Michael doesn't just walk out on people, we're talking about Mr. Loyalty here and I can see how he'd always be a little shaky that Maria would leave him. That's why I just couldn't see him taking her back as fast as he did in the series. Yes, Michael is loyal, but he's also the one who clams up and refuses to trust people. I know they were trying to wrap the series up, but canon Michael wouldn't have reconciled that fast.

I must admit I was cheering for the Evil!Michael when he kicked her out of the car and told her what he thought of her behavior, for once. And Maria wanted him to apologize?

Completely impractical of her since she's basically making him come apart at the seams and when he finally does put his foot down, she acts like he's the reason everything is happening. Uh, no, he was perfectly fine before you went nuts.


He already has issues with being unworthy or a "monster" because of his powers. He doesn't need any more.


And that's what makes her rejection of him more painful than Liz's issues with Max to me. There was no wedge of fate driven between Michael and Maria. Michael was a devoted, loving , albeit slightly dense at times, mate, and she just throws all that back at him. He can't take the rejection like Max can. Michael is already hard enough on himself, he doesn't need someone else undermining his self esteem. And he doesn't deserve it either. He's a GOOD guy who turns into a boyfriend that any girl would kill for.

Ok, simple proposition. If you love someone, you want them to be happy and you want to be with them.

And Michael deserves that. He loves her. He's given up everything for her. He's completely devoted to her. He'd have given her space if she'd asked him properly. He's inadvertantly blowing things up he's so upset that she's leaving him and then she puts a guilt trip on him and basically leaves him bleeding. It makes you question if Maria really knows what love is and if she really does love Michael, which I never would have questioned in S2. Michael deserves better.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I don't see how he could conceivably not always have in the back of his mind that Maria might just walk out on him again and not come back

Exactly. After all, what has changed? He was an alien guy who was a loving, loyal, and steady boyfriend who took care of her. He still is. Only now the FBI is after him. If she could walk out before, despite it all, what's to stop her from doing it again.

Michael needs someone who will love him fully and unconditionally and who he can be secure with. And he had all of that, but after her melt-down in S3, I don't think he can ever again.

just couldn't see him taking her back as fast as he did

Exactly. She'd have to work way harder than she did in the beginning of S2. When he was pushing her away then, it was to protect her.

The whole situation reminds me of a line in S4 of Farscape, where Crichton tells Aeryn: "I would trust you with my life but not my heart." Because, honestly, she threw it all back in his face for no fault of his own, here. And twisted the knife a few times, for fun.

In my little fanwanky brain, I prefer to think that once they are on the road, they work on it and don't just get together right away (well, in an even fanwankier one, we discover she had a weird form of space virus and the real Maria is back).

Uh, no, he was perfectly fine before you went nuts.

Yes, I loved seeing early S3 Michael, who was happy and relaxed and had friends and was actually comfortable in his own skin for once.

He can't take the rejection like Max can

And the one time Max couldn't take rejection was the S2 eps right after he found out Liz "slept" with Kyle. Because except for that, he knew she loved him. But Michael? That is exactly what Maria does to him. She might be saying "I love you" but all Michael hears (and rightly) is "I am leaving you because I don't want to be with you." Liz had a good excuse. Maria? Nope.

I think it was a real miscalculation on the writers' parts to break them up. It completely went against Maria's previous character and made no sense. I guess they thought they wouldn't be interesting without angst, but that's dumb. I had plenty of fun watching them interact as a couple.

And that's what makes her rejection of him more painful than Liz's issues with Max to me.

Liz and Max's problems were all from the outside. There was no question they loved each other. But here Maria herself is rejecting a guy who she supposedly loves and who loves her back because...why? She is feeling extra flaky?

He's a GOOD guy who turns into a boyfriend that any girl would kill for.

Seriously, Maria, have your head checked. Do you really think you will find another guy who will take care of you the way Michael did when Alex died? and who will always be there for you, no exaggeration.

He's inadvertantly blowing things up he's so upset that she's leaving him and then she puts a guilt trip on him and basically leaves him bleeding.

Indeed. Something to the effect of "I need to figure out my future and what I want out of life, but when you are around I can't think of anything else" type speech is a lot better. That, plus reassurances that you will come back (he looks like a lost little kid when he asks her that and my heart just goes out to him).

Because, to paraphrase "Little Prince," "you are responsible for those you've tamed." Maria is responsible for Michael's well-being because he loves her and she has given him reason to do so. Not to take care of those who love you is truly selfish.

It makes you question if Maria really knows what love is and if she really does love Michael

You just don't do that to someone you love. When Liz was hurting Max she was falling apart, even if it was to save the world or to physically survive. Maria has no such excuses, but doesn't seem to be bothered (or even noticing) what she is doing to Michael.

She's actually pretty pod-like. I am thinking of the ep where Liz finds out Max is dead, and sorry. Just the way Maria interacts with Liz is NOT how you should interact with someone whose love just died. (She also doesn't seem to grieve much herself, either). Where is the Maria I loved and what happened to her?

[poisontaster]

Um. Sounds like a good reason to write fic, to me.

*ducks, runs & hides*

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yes, but the only fic I think of at the moment involves Maria snapping out of a bizarre form of mind control and grovelling for hours and that won't make for good fic :)

Though if there is fic that deals with the whole mess, I'd love to read ot.

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

Where is the Maria I loved and what happened to her?

She apparently had that season off.

Michael needs someone who will love him fully and unconditionally and who he can be secure with.

In a relationship Michael can't be the "anchor". Yes he's loyal and rock steady, but his personality is too volatile to be the one in a relationship that waits at home by the phone while the other party is out "finding themselves". He needs someone laid back who will give him a long leash and be secure in the fact that he'll always come back, because he will. Michael proves over and over that leaving is never an option for him.

She might be saying "I love you" but all Michael hears (and rightly) is "I am leaving you because I don't want to be with you." Liz had a good excuse. Maria? Nope.


And Michael's personality is very different from Max's. Max is much more trusting and secure and has an idea of his own self worth. Michael is damaged goods. You have to prove to him that you're not going to let him down. He's had too many people give him lip service and then leave him to fend for himself.

he looks like a lost little kid when he asks her that and my heart just goes out to him

That part kills me. He's just so vulnerable it hurts. And he's the "tough" character, which makes it harder. How could she be as harsh as she was with him if she had even looked at him at all. He really is alone in the world and she's just cutting off his life support with her actions.

"you are responsible for those you've tamed."

That perfectly describes Michael, because he is the "stray dog" of the group. When he's cornered, he lashes out, when people hurt him he resembles a kicked puppy. Maria "domesticates" him (and he proved he'd be great domestic material), she gets through his defenses, she makes him need her, and then she kicks him to the curb. I happen to own a stray dog that was abused before I got her and she's the most loyal animal I've ever had, incredibly eager to please and jealously loyal. I don't see Michael as being any different and for Maria to treat him how she did in the end was cruel. I don't even see why he'd take her back in the end because I didn't see her offering effusive apologies.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

She apparently had that season off.

I honestly have no idea where they were going that season with her character.

Michael proves over and over that leaving is never an option for him.

He decided not to go back to Antar for her. He is not going anywhere. I think he deserves someone who is willing to do that for him.

But yes, he is insecure about his self-worth. How could he not be, with his background? He is not going to be "oh fine honey. Go find yourself while I have fun." He loves her and needs her too much for that and is too afraif of losing her.

He's had too many people give him lip service and then leave him to fend for himself.

And Maria joins the long line. If you think about it, the only two people who, fight or not, never give up on him are his "siblings" Max and Isabel, and even Isabel betrayed him in his past life.

He really is alone in the world and she's just cutting off his life support with her actions.

He doesn't have anyone but her. His only other "family" are Isabel who is newly married and Max who is like a brother to him but has plenty of his own stuff to deal with. Basically, Michael deserves to always come first to someone. And for Isabel, he is not first (understandably), nor for Max (understandably as well).

How could she be as harsh as she was with him if she had even looked at him at all

I've broken up with guys I've dated for a few months and who certainly weren't ideal boyfriend material and I felt worse.

Actually, why can't she be "finding herself" AND dating him at the same time? He is so busy most of the time, it's not like he demands scads of attention. And he is proud of her singing talent. He would be very helpful and understanding (I love how he was going to have Jesse go over her contract). The only way you need to break up with someone to find yourself is if finding yourself involves sleeping with other people.

Maria to treat him how she did in the end was cruel

As you said, she's got through all his defenses, battered them down one by one, and then just gave up. I found it interesting how early S3 Michael was trying to graduate etc, but by Graduation, it's clear he isn't. because he was doing it for Maria and she is gone so he gave up.

When you have that power over a person, you should be very responsble about not abusing your trust.

I don't even see why he'd take her back in the end because I didn't see her offering effusive apologies.

I guess he loves her and doesn't have anyone else. He might just be thankful to have her back, because it was either that or never EVER even see her again. But I do think she will have to do some hard work to get him to really open up to her again.

I hope what Liz said to her at the Finale finally snapped her head on the right way.

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

It basically boiled down to Maria wanting what Maria wanted and not caring about Michael. Michael is one of those characters who grows on you. Like I said, he's not white knight at face value, but he is one underneath it all, you just have to be patient with him. For her to stick by him that long and then just give up on him made no sense, especially when she's just about got him about as good as anyone is ever going to get Michael.

And it's not like Michael is smothering her. He doesn't like being smothered and he sort of does his own thing most of the time. The only thing he's doing is acting like a responsible (gasp, using that word in context with Michael) male. He's just acting ideally "husbandy". Let's face it, Michael is pretty low maintenance. All he needs is someone to be there solidly for him and he's fine. I don't see how that was so much to ask.

I like to think he found something better (or that Maria grovelled herself back into his good graces), because I just don't like the fact that he'd let her walk all over him and then just take her back. Michael is better than that (and it's out of character too, since Michael is no push over).

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

The thing that frustrated me so much about the whole thing was that it was just so against her character as we'd known it. It just made no sense whatsoever.

And yes, Michael might not spout pretty speeches, but he can say the most amazing things sometimes, and what's more important, he acts in ways that show how much he cares for you. You can always be safe with him around.

He hadn't done a thing to deserve being dumped. Which makes the whole thing bloody unfair.

I like to think he found something better (or that Maria grovelled herself back into his good graces), because I just don't like the fact that he'd let her walk all over him and then just take her back. Michael is better than that (and it's out of character too, since Michael is no push over).

I guess they got them together back so quickly because the show was going to be cancelled. And I am glad they resolved it. But it was too quick. I suppose if there had been a 4th season, this would have had more time to work out.

As to Maria? The new Maria, who knows what goes on in her head. But the old Maria would certainly do everything to get him back.

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

The thing I always loved about Michael is that when he laid his cards on the table, he laid his cards on the table. No head games, no manipulation. He was just very unselfish and devoted. Yes, he was completely random sometimes, but that made him sort of fun. He was low maintenance, you didn't have to impress him and he listens. Personally I would have rather had him than Max, since Max is way too mushy and devoted for me. Of course I'm not a typical female.

It was just an unsatisfactory end for M/M. Yes, it was nice to watch Michael angst a little for a change, but they didn't have to turn Maria into a villain to do it.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yes, I did love the "what you see is what you get" thing about Michael.

As to Michael v. Max, I don't know. I like Max's devotion and "mushiness" but he is a very obsessive person and can get really carried away (the way he did with his son).

it was nice to watch Michael angst a little for a change, but they didn't have to turn Maria into a villain to do it.

If they wanted to break them up, they could have always come up with something else, something external. What they did was just dumb.